Thanks for your posting and the link to the article. The big fight over evolution and creationism is nothing compared to these ideas. If your deepest spiritual experience is a result of brain chemistry which is common to all humans and the only difference is your understanding of it that is based on your culture, then, what do you do with that whole complex of doctrines and theology you call religion. Good stuff. This a real question.

I find #2 quote very interesting, I always thought that even the most of traditional scientists have had some personal emotion linked to their findings, even if it was 'behind' them and their research. How could they as humans, and we be, really be completely separate anyway? I would like to hear more information concerning any other research on the #3 quote. 'justintlookin', how has having access to this information changed your personal outlook on life, and in what ways? Thank you!

neraja, thanks for pointing this out to me I was doing some research that's related to this yesterday, literally as you must have been writing the PM. Serendipity? :-)

I suspect Mr Brooks, the article author, may be late to the party. I seem to remember discussions touching these areas back in the 70s while the biofeedback machine was plugged in.

Which takes me to measuring transcendent experiences. In the 70s and earlier. We knew back then about the four major "states of the brain," Alpha, Beta, Theta, and Delta brain waves dominating.

Alpha is sort of on standby, waiting for something to happen. Beta is pretty much our normal state, and I'm sure you know Delta is the dominate wave when sleeping.

Theta waves also associate with sleep. But measurements have been taken of Zen monks meditating. They go into a theta state at the peak of meditation. Of course, that takes years of study and practice. [This is where my research fell in - people in flotation tanks (AKA isolation/sensory deprivation/and a couple of other names) also enter a theta state.]

What that means seems open to further investigation. It leads to more relaxation as the brain is freed from handling the tons of sensory input every millisecond. It seems to have effects on the physical body, again maybe because the freed brain has time to make minute corrections it might not get around to when occupied. Theta state also seems to allow for what some have called "superlearning."

I don't think there is any "merger with a larger presence" involved unless we consider connection with ourselves in ways that may not be possible outside this meditative state as the larger presence. And that may well be what they are talking about. Monks have found ways to reach inside and control things we usually consider automatic and beyond our control. Perhaps they've found a huge internal universe the rest of us simply don't know about.

I suspect question 3 is just a rephrasing of a question we all recognize. "Why do people do that?"

Particularly, "Why do people do things that are good for the group but are not in their personal best interest?" You know,

"Why does the hunter risk his life on an elephant to feed the whole pride when he could kill a nice safe mouse and feed himself?"

"Why does the bread winner jeopardize his health with hard work and job stress to support family, especially extended family?"

The scientific side of those questions so far seems to be saying "Because we have developed genetically to ensure survival of the species over personal well being."

Have I killed the discussion yet?

I certainly dont want to 'kill the discussion' yet either, but I must ask, do we really know whats in a gene and what gives it 'life'?

This is a fascinating topic. Just this last week or so I have been looking at brainwave entrainment. There is so much information out there. I ran across a guy by the name of Eric Thompson. He has a very interesting profile on MySpace:

http://www.myspace.com/integraleric

He has fully recovered from being bipolar and is now doing some very in depth and thought-provoking work in this area as a result of using brainwave entrainment and Yoga Nidra. He has a couple of interesting web sites as well. Here is one of them:

http://metanoiamind.com/default.aspx

Yoga Nidra:

http://www.nondual.com/index.html

I think these kinds of things can be a very valuable tool in quieting the mind chatter and letting go of those things that keep us from realizing what and who we are.

I'd love to hear from you all.

Brinn

I think I can safely say we know what's in a gene. Chemically, even how the chemicals seem to operate.

But I can't answer the life question yet. I can't define life.

Is a virus alive? It doesn't have a cell, can't reproduce unless it has invaded a living cell. Yet we see how efficient they can be from things like AIDS and the 1918 flu epidemic.

About all a virus is is a chunk of RNA or DNA inside a shell. And a gene is just a chunk - sans shell- that has an identifiable function in the overall helix of DNA.

Bryn, that second link, the metanoia mind, leaves me with a few questions.

Does normal consumer audio equipment work or are high-end system required to handle the hi-freq components? How does the state of one's hearing affect results? How controlled does the environment have to be; can you use it while TBDing, with other people i nthe house, etc, or does it need significant isolation?

Since flotation therapy allows access to the theta state fairly quickly, might a series of visits, say one a week for 6 weeks, provide better and faster access to the benefits?